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Installing Win7 On A (Newer) Unsupported Notebook: Stuck On Boot Logo (UEFI Only)


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#1 Zoso_The_Internet_Tard

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Posted 11 April 2016 - 01:13 AM

I have an ASUS Zenbook UX305, which came with 8.1 and is currently running 10. I haven't checked yet, but most of the drivers available for it are probably for 8.1/10, so the biggest challenge will be finding 7-specific drivers that work. I would rather use 10 but think that 7 will be most stable overall, and has higher compatibility with more software. I plan to use this ultrabook mostly for coding, Office, school and work, and testing out booting-related stuff I find here and elsewhere. The graphics card is far too weak to play modern games, it's optimized for efficiency and battery life. WiFI also doesn't work. All my USB ports are 3.0, which 7 doesn't install a driver for during setup.

 

The main issue right now is that I get stuck on 7's boot logo during the initial setup when running in UEFI mode. I had the exact same issue on my Alienware M14X R1, so I think this must either be an issue with 7 itself, or an issue with how 7 interacts with UEFI. I checked the SHA-1 hash of the install.wim on my MSDN ISO (also hashed) and compared it to the hash of the install.wim on the USB. They are identical, so I know my source files aren't corrupt. I tried installing several times with both the official GUI setup and via imagex, same results every time

 

I can turn on the legacy/CSM mode in the BIOS, 7 willl then install to an MBR-partitioned disk in legacy mode, and boots from it just fine. I tried the UEFI DUET emulator to see if it could boot 7 in emulated UEFI mode, but it seems to be incompatible with my processor. I haven't yet tried Clover (another boot manager that can boot in either native UEFI mode or emulated UEFI mode). I also plan to try rEFInd. Both of these boot managers allowed me to boot in emulated UEFI on my Alienware M14X R1, even though it couldn't boot with the limited, native UEFI capabilities of my BIOS (even though all other OSes like 8.1/10/Linux never had any issues with it.

 

I would rather boot all my OSes in UEFI rather than legacy even though the SSD is only 256GB, if only because I believe that UEFI is more compatible and optimized for my hardware.

 

Thanks for any suggestions!



#2 Agent47

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Posted 11 April 2016 - 07:33 AM

 

 

I would rather boot all my OSes in UEFI rather than legacy even though the SSD is only 256GB, if only because I believe that UEFI is more compatible and optimized for my hardware.

 

 

With all sue respect, i disagree. It would make sense if your machine has a bigger HDD (>2TB) which require GPT partitioning to utilize all available space  or your OS support "SecureBoot". Support for larger capacity hard drives, support for 4096 bytes sector size and the ability to boot from a GPT partitioned disk are the main advantages native UEFI mode provides over CSM/legacy mode. In your case, neither you don't have a large HDD/SSD nor your OS support "SecureBoot". Personally i don't see any advantage in using UEFI mode - in your particular situation.

 

 

 

 

The main issue right now is that I get stuck on 7's boot logo during the initial setup when running in UEFI mode. I had the exact same issue on my Alienware M14X R1, so I think this must either be an issue with 7 itself, or an issue with how 7 interacts with UEFI.

  

As a PC tech, i have installed 8.1 and 10 in both UEFI and CSM modes. But i never had much luck with Win7 and UEFI. Although Win7 theoretically support UEFI (with SecureBoot off), my personal experience suggests that this support is half boiled and not fully compatible with all machines ( i would say - "Experimental"). I have witnessed the issue you described in your OP multiple times. Sometimes a BIOS update can fix that and most times you have to switch to CSM if you absolutely need to run Win7.

 

On the other hand, Win8 and higher Operating Systems are designed with UEFI in mind. For example, Win8/10 installed in UEFI mode can detect the native resolution of monitor and set it even if no graphics card driver is installed - Win7 on UEFI can't do that. "SecureBoot" is another example which is designed to take advantages of UEFI firmware.



#3 Rootman

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Posted 11 April 2016 - 12:38 PM

I would tend to agree with Agent47, unless you MUST have GPT - because the disk it > 2TB or you need more than 4 Primary partitions, then stick with good old tried and true CSM booting.  Unless the laptop simply won't boot CSM.  I've yet to find one that won't boot CSM but that just shows how few laptops I've worked on.

 

Yes, EFI booting on Win 7 is flakey, works like a charm on 8, 8.1 and 10 but is prone to issues with 7.

 

The best bet it just return to CSM boot.  Or switch to Win 10 and boot either EFI or CSM.  Once you get all the crap removed and the interface tweaked it's not that bad. 



#4 sbaeder

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Posted 12 April 2016 - 12:17 AM

I would totally agree with the above comments...  Just because it is in "Bios" compatible mode does NOT mean it is an actual "bios".  All the code in the boot rom is newer code.  Why torture yourself - as mentioned, Win 7 NOT designed for UEFI...so don't try to force it - that is *IF* you insist on using Win 7

 

Go for Win 10!  That is what the HW was designed for (like USB3, etc.) and as stated - a few tweaks here and there (think classic shell), and you're good to go for all the things you mentioned!



#5 Zoso_The_Internet_Tard

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Posted 18 April 2016 - 08:27 AM

So.....I did more testing and discovered that turning on CSM in my BIOS is all it takes to get 7 to boot on my hardware, while still installing in UEFI mode on a GPT partition table. Installing in legacy mode on MBR isn't required. Simply activating this one option is all it took. I used rEFInd to boot the Windows loader. My BIOS seems to give the option to boot *either* UEFI or legacy as long as CSM is on. I was going to try milindsmart's GPT on BIOS methods if this failed, but it looks like it wasn't necessary.

 

I'm upgrading the 256GB SSD to a 512GB Samsung SSD very soon.This will allow me to keep 7 and 10, 7 for any softwares that aren't 10-compatible. And I can have several installed Linuxes.

 

@ agent47: I can see your point about UEFI being able to set the native resolution even without a video driver. If CSM is turned off then rEFInd will display at my monitor's max res. But if it is on then it's scaled but bigger. No big deal, since functionality isn't affected. Windows in UEFI has failed to demonstrate this ability.

 

@ Rootman:I'm committed to UEFI and GPT as a matter of principle, because it's the relatively new and improving standard on which the computers of the future will boot/operate on. UEFI/GPT is supposed to provide a number of benefits that the older legacy standard cannot provide, because of limitations in legacy that either have not been overcome or are too fraught with technicalities to overcome. So a newer, more modern standard was devised. I would rather not be stuck in the past relying on old, aging technology, even if it just works and is tried and true. With that said, I also recognize that legacy/BIOS/MBR/CSM has served PC computing well for quite awhile, and there is a lot of experience that can be had by immersing oneself in the old ways. People who forget/ignore the past and it lessons are doomed to repeat past mistakes in the future, and this also applies to world society as a whole.

 

I would like to be able set up a unified partition table on my PCs that will allow for booting either UEFI or legacy OSes on the same drive(s). A hybrid MBR may be needed, or perhaps BIOS on GPT, or maybe UEFI on MBR. In any case maintaining GPT partitioning or some degree of it is preferred, even though this may mean extreme difficulty in booting legacy OSes on said drive. Learning the knowledge to become experienced in different booting methods is my main purpose here on Reboot.



#6 Agent47

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Posted 23 April 2016 - 04:54 PM

Hi

 

Glad to hear that your problem is solved by turning on CSM mode. I guess it's manufacturer dependent. For example, Acer UEFI firmware doesn't have an option to enable CSM/Legacy support along with UEFI. Selecting UEFI will completely disable "Leagcy" and vice versa. So is Dell (most models i have seen). But HP allows enabling "Legacy Support" without the need to disable UEFI.



#7 stayboogy

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Posted 23 April 2016 - 11:00 PM

Hi

 

Glad to hear that your problem is solved by turning on CSM mode. I guess it's manufacturer dependent. For example, Acer UEFI firmware doesn't have an option to enable CSM/Legacy support along with UEFI. Selecting UEFI will completely disable "Leagcy" and vice versa. So is Dell (most models i have seen). But HP allows enabling "Legacy Support" without the need to disable UEFI.

 

quite the contrary with most dells--if the bios is point and click then uefi boot is always available as it is what it expects, legacy is always available as well as long as there is a bootloader on said device trying to be booted and boot options are preselected at boot time. 

 

newer hps are quite the same except for lacking point and click setup interaction.  but it always expects uefi so it's always available.  how it interacts with legacy boot options seems to be machine dependent.

 

to the op:

 

i would just boot windows 7 in uefi mode using the windows 10 bootmgr instead of having to change csm options and do a manual install of windows 7 by applying the install.wim.  the updated bootmgr is by far superior to the 7 bootmgr.



#8 Zoso_The_Internet_Tard

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 10:53 PM

@ stayboogy: CSM still need to be enabled in my case even if 7 wasnt installed,I have alot of other legacy OSes that wont boot without it. As long as Ican do UEFI and CSM at the same time, then I see no harm in it being on. Everything seems to work mostly the same.

 

I always knew 10's bootmgr could boot 7, and figured it was better than 7's bootmgr.

 

However my steps at the time of the OP, if I recall correctly, were to apply the 7 wim with 7's version of WAIK, and install boot files via bcdboot with the 10 WAIK (7's WAIK had given errors at this step).7 hung on the logo regardless and would go no further if CSM was off. This was on a clean disk and 10 wasnt present.

 

On my 2nd test 10 was already present, I just applied the wim with 7's WAIK, and updated 10's BCD with bootrec (instead of installing *new* boot files, which wasnt necessary). Regardless, 7's boot wouldnt finish to completion if CSM was off.






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