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#1 steve6375

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Posted 11 January 2016 - 05:53 PM

This 200 year old patch box was on the Antiques Road show TV programme held at Bowood House recently.

No one has been able to solve the meaning of the numbers around the top.

There is an inscription around the lid edge, but unfortunately I don't know all the words around the edge.

The numbers seem to have a sort of sideways comma separator and also some numbers have a bar over the top.

Some numbers seem to be repeated (e.g. 45 and 288) which may mean repeated words?

Some of the numbers appear to be quite large, e.g. 288 or 88 or 83 which is puzzling.

It could be a straight alphabet code or possibly a code based on words and letters in the inscription written on the side. None of the words are very long from what I could see (largest was about 8-10 letters). It may even be from the bible! Who knows!

The TV program did not show all the words around the side. It was not read out but was reported to say 'something like'  ...

 

'the ring is round and hath no end so unto my love now my friend'   ??? 

 

It is difficult to make it out.

 

P.S. I don't know the answer to this. AFAIK, no one does!

Attached Files



#2 steve6375

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Posted 11 January 2016 - 06:11 PM

Various Google searches reveal some quotes...

This ring is round and hath no end so is my love unto my friend

A ring is round and has no end, as does my love for you my friend

This ring is round and hath no end, so is my love for you, my friend.

The ring is round and hath no end. So is my love for you my dier friend

This Ring is round And hath no end… ... So is my Love To thee my Friend


Edited by steve6375, 11 January 2016 - 06:24 PM.


#3 steve6375

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Posted 11 January 2016 - 06:14 PM

A transcript of the programme from Bowood House is here

http://subsaga.com/b...od-house-2.html

 

Starts at 2:40



#4 Quadrasite

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 09:47 AM

New here as I was looking around to see if anyone else had tried to solve this.  My thought was it was a straight letter cipher.  

 

Some of the numbers have dashes after them, and some have a line over the top, so for example there is 6, 6. and 6-(With a line on top).  Given that the numbers include 0 that gives 30 possible numbers so more than enough for a substitution cipher.

 

I had a quick crack at this and got:

 

66.3  54-46.  4-5.  5.92-88

16-6. 83-03-  4-5.  2-88

 

bed wife is small

the logo is all

 

Which is probably close but not it.

 

Only the first word doesn't have a number with a line over the top, so I thought maybe those were vowels and 66.3 could be "Why" but in the end had to concede that maybe 6. was E

 

The word that makes it tough is 83-03-  which comes out as Logo if your looking for modern words, but could be a name or nickname perhaps.

 

Anyway, that's as far as I got.  If you want the pure cipher text converted from numbers to letters it is:

 

abc defb eg ghijj klb jmnm eg ijj

 

Good luck!

Dom



#5 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 11:06 AM

What about

 

The gift is small but love is all

 

http://www.ebay.co.u...0-/381512087280



#6 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 11:26 AM

66.3  54-46.  4-5.  5.92-88
16-6. 85-03-  4-5.  2-88

 

suspect the 3 is a 5 ??



#7 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 11:56 AM

The first word seems wrong?? Should be  6.63-   not 66.3 ???



#8 Quadrasite

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:06 PM

The first word is definitely 6 6(with dash after it) 3 but I agree the 4 letter word upside down could be 85-03-

 

I'll take a look and see if that gives better options:)

 

Unfortunately The gift is small but love is all doesn't seem to match the patterns quite right but is probably very closer (And better than Logo!)



#9 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:16 PM

aeiou must be 2- 3- 4- 5- 6-

bcdfghj must be 1234567

l = 8

m = 9

 

not sure what happens with k ???

 

5. = s

6. = t

 

why is v not 7.  instead of 0 ??



#10 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:22 PM

The first word is definitely 6 6(with dash after it) 3 but I agree the 4 letter word upside down could be 85-03-

 

 

On the box it is 6 6 dot 3   (not dash??)

I think should be 6.63-   ??



#11 Quadrasite

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:27 PM

I thought of that which would make a == 0 (To begin your bcdfghj)  (perhaps).

 

I've got as far as:

 

6T3 GIFT IS SMALL BUT LOVE IS ALL

 

but can't see what you could put in for 6 & 3 for that to make sense (Given they can't be letters used elsewhere so it can't even be "its")



#12 Quadrasite

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:27 PM

I thought of that which would make a == 0 (To begin your bcdfghj)  (perhaps).

 

I've got as far as:

 

6T3 GIFT IS SMALL BUT LOVE IS ALL

 

but can't see what you could put in for 6 & 3 for that to make sense (Given they can't be letters used elsewhere so it can't even be "its")



#13 Quadrasite

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:29 PM

On the box it is 6 6 dot 3   (not dash??)

I think should be 6.63-   ??

Ah, that's my notation.  As the dot comes after the letter in the cipher text I've put it there in my notation as well so my 

 

66.3 is 6, 6 with a dot, 3



#14 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 12:29 PM

I think the original author just made a mistake? or perhaps, he gave the numbers to a craftsman who burnt them on (it looks like amateur? poker work) but got it wrong?

6.63- = the 



#15 jonboy

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 01:00 PM

All the occurences Google knows of begin with "The" or "This".

 

I wondered if it could be "My" or "Me"?

Easy to invert 6 and 9.



#16 steve6375

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 01:05 PM

The Anno Domini script seems to be much better quality than the numbers, which makes me suspect that the numbers were a later addition by an amateur? So I am guessing he/she just got it a bit wrong? The numbers in the first word are correct but just the dots and dash are wrong??



#17 steve6375

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Posted 18 January 2016 - 03:19 PM

Looks like someone else is claiming to have cracked it first!

http://www.telegraph...how-viewer.html

http://generalwhiske...-1/#comment-761






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