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Winbuilder 2013 on com! magazine this month


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#1 Nuno Brito

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:57 PM

Hi,

 

Just noticed that the new winbuilder is being listed on the current edition of com! inside the multi-boot article.

 

The screenshot of wb shows a saying from Paraglider, I guess he is going to get even more famous after this. :)

 

com-dvd-2013-11.jpg

 

 

I just don't understand why they suggest people to run the "install win7pe" command instead of the using the normal "auto" to do all the steps.

 

In either case, it is now available for those interested to check out the article.

 

:cheers:

 



#2 homes32

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 07:05 PM


I just don't understand why they suggest people to run the "install win7pe" command instead of the using the normal "auto" to do all the steps.

 

non-existent/poor documentation????? :)

 

ha! beat ya to it Wonko!!



#3 Nuno Brito

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 07:26 PM

non-existent/poor documentation????? :)

 

ha! beat ya to it Wonko!!

 

The only documentation available officially just specifies "AUTO". :smiling9:



#4 homes32

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 08:38 PM

If not yet done, download the WinBuilder application from reboot.pro

  • Start WinBuilder
  • Type "install win7pe" and hit "Enter / Return". Wait for download and install.
  • Type "source" and hit "Enter / Return". Navigate to your source CD and "Open" it.
  • Type "build" and hit "Enter / Return".
WinBuilder will now build a bootable ISO using factory settings, and tell you the path to it in the command window.
You may burn this ISO to a CD / DVD or test in an emulator.


linked to on download center page. This is where they are getting it from.

#5 Nuno Brito

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 09:46 PM

D**n. We got a leak.. :dubbio:

 

Thanks for the reference. :)



#6 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 12:57 PM

D**n. We got a leak.. :dubbio:

Now, calling pscEx a whistleblower is frankly a bit too much!  :ranting2: 

 

;)

 

:rofl2:

 

:cheers:

Wonko



#7 pscEx

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 01:49 PM

The download page says:

 

New users which do not have a Win7 source CD available, can start WinBuilder, type AUTO <return> in the GUI.

WinBuilder will then
  • Download a Win7 SP1 English source CD ISO
    Depending on the internet bandwidth the download needs between half an hour (cable connection) and several hours.
  • Extract the ISO
  • Define the extracted ISO as source for the build
  • Download and install the Win7PE project
  • Run the Win7PE project
  • Build a bootable ISO with the built PE
Experienced users can follow this description.
 

 

Here clearly is "AUTO" recommended.

 

The link homes32 refers to, is for experienced users.



#8 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:28 PM

The link homes 32 refers to, is for experienced users.

Isn't the target for the com! magazine (wannabe :whistling:) expert/experienced users?  :unsure:

 

:cheers:

Wonko



#9 pscEx

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:35 PM

Yes. :clap:

 

And then the com! evidence gives no arguments to criticize.

 

Peter :smart:



#10 pscEx

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:52 PM

I just don't understand why they suggest people to run the "install win7pe" command instead of the using the normal "auto" to do all the steps.

@Nuno,

 

IMO whe have to fix some small glitches.

 

When the user already has defined a valid source anywhere on his host, and executes "AUTO", then WinBuilder starts a download of a "standard source CD" into <basedir>\source

 

Even when the user already has defined a valid project,  "AUTO" downloads the Win7PE project.

 

I have some opinions what to do next days ...

 

Peter :cheers:



#11 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:56 PM

 

Even when the user already has defined a valid project,  "AUTO" downloads the Win7PE project.

You seemingly forgot "among the large number of available choices" after "valid project"  :jaclaz:

 

:cheers:

Wonko



#12 pscEx

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:00 PM

I did not forget.

 

On my host there exists a (95%) clone of Win7PE, called "myTest".

 

I agree that respecting your restricted knowledge, your post can be accepted.

 

On the other hand: For the first "AUTO" of a new user, Win7PE will remain the automagically downloaded project.

 

Peter :cheers:



#13 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:29 PM

Sure :), it could be an idea to provide a choice selection menu, you know something like:
 

Please choose one among the available projects:

  • Win7PE (Auto)
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE
  • Win7PE (95%)
Press Page Down for more choices listing the same, only, Win7PE available project, with decreasing percentages...


:cheers:
Wonko

#14 pscEx

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:44 PM

That is a suggestion which could be implied easily.

But please remember, that the new user should type only "AUTO" and will get a usable result.

 

I think that Nuno (and I agree) will not like your suggestion.

 

To surpise a new user with a list of (for him) unknown project names, is not a good idea.

 

Let's give the new user one established and working (small) project.

Everything else like adding some plugins from the cloud, or selecting a different project, may be his later choice.

 

Peter :smart:



#15 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 09:32 AM

To surpise a new user with a list of (for him) unknown project names, is not a good idea.

 

Let's give the new user one established and working (small) project.

Everything else like adding some plugins from the cloud, or selecting a different project, may be his later choice.

 

In other words one comes to your (say) Chinese restaurant, and since the customer is western, and your waiter doesn't know him as a long time customer, he is not allowed to be surprised by a menu :w00t:, nor to order shrimp wontons (which is what he would actually like to eat) but he is served Mui Fan fried rice and sweet and sour pork instead :ph34r:.

 

The new approach is "consider anyone you don't know as ignorant and demented until proved to be knowledgeable and/or intelligent".

 

 Interesting, I am pretty sure that there will be queues of people outside the restaurant (and BTW you additionally saved a lot of money from NOT changing the sign outside it that says "Da Mamma Gina - Italian Restaurant" :whistling:).

 

Would this approach be somehow connected to the fact that you only have fried rice and sweet and sour pork, or it is just due to your general attitude towards customers' satisfaction?

 

It would be easier if the new user shouldn't type "AUTO" at all, but the thingy would build the "Auto" project automatically as soon as the program is run, unless it is invoked with a parameter "/NOAUTO" or keys ALT+ESC+F12 are pressed within 6 milliseconds from launch.

 

:cheers:

Wonko



#16 paraglider

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 11:48 AM

Given the user got as far as typing auto I think that indicates some experience. As long as the list comes with more details than a project name don't think it increases the complexity that much to present a choice of projects.

 

Don't think this thread is the best place for discussion about the usability of the new winbuilder.



#17 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 01:46 PM

Don't think this thread is the best place for discussion about the usability of the new winbuilder.

As a matter of fact this thread is all about the non-usability of it, or, more explicitly on the ways the actual developers of the tool try to make things more difficult to the users (and they are seemingly also happy about it).

 

A command line interface  is not that difficult to "design".

A few points to consider:

  • You have to choose beforehand IF you want to give the user an option or not.
  • IF you do, it would make sense to make this option "easy" AND document it.
  • IF you do not, then DO NOT require the user to type anything.
  • IF a choice is given AND you don't want to make this option "easy" AND the user choice is very narrowly limited to type EITHER between "AUTO" OR "Win7PE", and BOTH choices will deliver the EXACT SAME result, then DO NOT whine about this info being published AND - much more than that - avoid assumptions on the (lack of) experience and knowledge of users (which you contributed to by NOT providing adequate documentation).

 

:cheers:

Wonko






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