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rebooting Boot Land


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#1 Nuno Brito

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 11:49 AM

Hello,

I am happy to announce that we are planning to soon move the Boot Land forums hosted at http://boot-land.net/forums onto our new home as http://reboot.pro

Preliminary testings have already took place and we have conditions to transfer and convert our forum system to the latest version of IPB 3 without loss of topics, messages, attachments or links. People visiting the older links for boot-land.net are automatically redirected onto the new location.

Subdomains on boot-land.net remain unchanged.

This idea began in early August, at the time our intent was moving Boot Land onto an even shorter domain hosted at http://w.bb (short for Windows Bulletin Board)

However, after 6 months the domain transfer was still not completed. We prepared our testings there, but this worries me about the reliability of their service to keep the domain name. So, I'm opting with a safer approach using a dot. pro domain.

Nevertheless, you can visit http://w.bb just for fun.

Just to clear any confusion, we will keep the default IPB skin while changing to http://reboot.pro but decided to create our own custom skin as well.

Across 2011, we intend to keep on improving the forum. Stay tuned for this reboot.

:cheers:

#2 homes32

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 10:46 PM

what is the purpose of having a shorter domain name? It it simply going to be a DNS alias or a new domain altogether? Is boot-land.net still going to be the primary gateway to the forums?
just curious. boot-land is a very descriptive and sensible name and fits what is going on here on the forums, where reboot.pro, while 3 characters shorter really gives you no idea what the site is about.

#3 Nuno Brito

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 11:56 PM

what is the purpose of having a shorter domain name?

  • Green computing as less bytes are wasted in the URL
  • Easier to share links
  • Prevents problems if we ever change to another board software
  • Looks cleaner
  • Faster to type on the computer keyboard
  • Easier to type on the PDA/Cellphone
  • Gets indexed faster by search engines
  • Can be printed safely on paper media
  • Simple to memorize
  • URL becomes easier to say over the phone or voice-only communication

It it simply going to be a DNS alias or a new domain altogether?

It is a new domain.

Is boot-land.net still going to be the primary gateway to the forums?

No.

just curious. boot-land is a very descriptive and sensible name and fits what is going on here on the forums, where reboot.pro, while 3 characters shorter really gives you no idea what the site is about.

Not really 3 chars, a typical URL will change from:
http://www.boot-land...showtopic=12965
to:
http://reboot.pro/12965/

I would agree with your perspective about a descriptive name if we were inclined to move onto http://w.bb while rebooting is without doubt our strong dish. Also, my preference has always been reboot even thought there wasn't that chance 4 years ago when this domain was first acquired.

This is an ongoing work in progress that started last August. At the time I've written down most of the proposed goals and reasons for this change: http://goo.gl/OGKOI

Some of the details are changing as we implement the plan, for example:
  • myBB was not used in favor of the new IP.Board version since it allowed similar functionality without loss of data
  • We are considering reboot.pro instead of w.bb since the .bb is not providing enough reliability
  • When implementing the new skin, many changes were a success but it is still not completed so we'll use the default while this work is in progress
  • Features like "mySubdomains" were ready but will now need to be converted.

Of course that it is easier to keep everything as is without changes like http://911cd.net or http://ubcd4win.com/forum for years in a row, but since when have we started to settle and being afraid of changes around here? :cheers:

#4 grubstake

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 02:23 AM

hello Nuno, and thank you again for the existence of the extremely helpful and useful sites/forums.

While I agree that your example was far more than 3 characters shorter, the poster was speaking of the domain-name; not the entire URL. There is no reason the same 'shortening' could not have been done with boot-land, or any other domain-name.

I will miss boot-land....I too think it perfectly expresses what lives here.

'reboot' does not.

Most importantly, I hope and hope that the focus on the 'skin' does not end up making the site into garish and bw-eating junk. I cannot get any broadband here in the mountains....only 31kb dialiup....so I have always much appreciated boot-land attention to 'clean' site design. Hope it stays that way. I care nothing for 'skins' or 'flash'.....only good info and good friends.

thank you again for all you've done to keep this site one of the very best.

#5 sbaeder

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 02:55 AM

what is the purpose of having a shorter domain name? It it simply going to be a DNS alias or a new domain altogether? Is boot-land.net still going to be the primary gateway to the forums?
just curious. boot-land is a very descriptive and sensible name and fits what is going on here on the forums, where reboot.pro, while 3 characters shorter really gives you no idea what the site is about.

I totally agree with homes32 here, AND I'm not sure that any of the "reasons" given by Nuno make any sense (at least not to me)...BUT, it isn't our call (in the end) :cheers:

So, bring it on...

#6 Nuno Brito

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 10:46 AM

I'm not sure that any of the "reasons" given by Nuno make any sense (at least not to me)

To be honest, this decision carries risks and disadvantages. Nevertheless, this change is necessary to improve our forum conditions in the long term.

Looking back in our history, this will be the third time that we move. First time was out of 911cd.net at Bart's request, the second when leaving the hosting at invisionfree. None of those was easy, ultimately each one of them unlocked the required conditions to grow at exponential rate.

It took a lot of work and planning, I really hope we can agree that this was worthwhile within some years as we do right now when looking back at 911 or the conditions at invisionfree. :cheers:

Most importantly, I hope and hope that the focus on the 'skin' does not end up making the site into garish and bw-eating junk. I cannot get any broadband here in the mountains....only 31kb dialiup....so I have always much appreciated boot-land attention to 'clean' site design. Hope it stays that way. I care nothing for 'skins' or 'flash'.....only good info and good friends.

The demonstration skin on http://w.bb should give a good example of possible performance. We've removed a lot of junk to make it lighter, still not finished thought.

#7 sbaeder

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 10:00 PM

To be honest, this decision carries risks and disadvantages. Nevertheless, this change is necessary to improve our forum conditions in the long term.

Only time will tell...But ALL of us have a responsibility to make that happen...Debate - Decide - Communicate are words I live by in the corporate world. I don't expect everyone to like the decision, but after the decision has been made - it is everyone's job to make it succeed!

So FULL SPEED AHEAD...Warp fact 6!

#8 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 12:59 PM

Only time will tell...But ALL of us have a responsibility to make that happen...Debate - Decide - Communicate are words I live by in the corporate world. I don't expect everyone to like the decision, but after the decision has been made - it is everyone's job to make it succeed!


Actually the motto on this kind of things has been till now:
  • Decide
  • Debate
  • Don't listen to ANY suggestion EVER made in the debate (or even worse, FAKE listening to suggestions, assuring they would be implemented, then do nothing like that)
  • Do whatever was decided initially
  • Communicate AFTER having done what was initially decided, which creates a number of problems

I do appreciate :smart: that it has been changed to:
  • Decide
  • Debate
  • Don't listen to ANY suggestion EVER made in the debate (or even worse, FAKE listening to suggestions, assuring they would be implemented, then do nothing like that)
  • Do whatever was decided initially
  • Communicate BEFORE having done what was initially decided, which anyway creates a number of problems

But still way to go, IMNSHO.

I like the new ideas, like a black text on white background - what has been discussed to death as being NOT the best choice for readability - and WOW! :worship: moving members' info on the right side (when all boards ever seen have this info on the left). This is both cool and l33t and surely will contribute to Alexa ranking of the new, misnamed site :frusty:.

Comeon, the most dreaded/awkward action in computing is rebooting, as it means that either the OS you are working on is really stoopid or - even worse - that the user is.

I personally see EACH reboot as a symptom of failure, much less serious than the need of a re-install, but still a hint that a problem exists.

There are worse names, though, a few examples:
  • www.missingNTLDR.net
  • www.itcrashedonme.com
  • www.OSnotfound.com


(just to have a preventive list of those NOT suggested for the next name change :worship:)

:worship:
Wonko

#9 Nuno Brito

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 04:07 PM

Decide
Debate
Don't listen to ANY suggestion EVER made in the debate (or even worse, FAKE listening to suggestions, assuring they would be implemented, then do nothing like that)
Do whatever was decided initially
Communicate BEFORE having done what was initially decided, which anyway creates a number of problems

Posted Image


I like the new ideas, like a black text on white background - what has been discussed to death as being NOT the best choice for readability - and WOW!

Posted Image


There are worse names, though, a few examples:
www.missingNTLDR.net
www.itcrashedonme.com
www.OSnotfound.com

Posted Image


Comeon, the most dreaded/awkward action in computing is rebooting, as it means that either the OS you are working on is really stoopid or - even worse - that the user is.

Posted Image

I personally see EACH reboot as a symptom of failure, much less serious than the need of a re-install, but still a hint that a problem exists.

Posted Image

(just to have a preventive list of those NOT suggested for the next name change )

I am happy to announce that...

Posted Image

#10 sambul61

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 04:32 PM

Nuno,

Nice pics... :worship: I do understand, there may be some fiscal reasons behind your intent to move to a new domain keeping in mind 100Gb/day bandwidth. Apparently, you also have notable on pages sponsors covering the costs.

BUT, Boot-Land is the Brand Name by now, well familiar to many PC users - that's what you keep proudly reporting in your blog, which is interesting and useful read for me btw. Corporate experience shows: never change a brand name, when you see its growing success and raising recognition and popularity. NEVER. In web world your IP address is a major part of your Brand Name.

May I suggest you to look through some IP related marketing books and talk to your school marketing professor (hope you take such classes their) before going full speed on this? Just a suggestion... :frusty: When looking to such major changes - that's where having Advisory Board would be handy.

Btw, I don't think this Board is about re-booting. It rather about having a boot choice for most if not all members and visitors with rarest exception.

#11 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 04:46 PM

Posted Image



Posted Image


:frusty:
Wonko

#12 amalux

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 04:59 PM

Actually the motto on this kind of things has been till now:

  • Decide
  • Debate
  • Don't listen to ANY suggestion EVER made in the debate (or even worse, FAKE listening to suggestions, assuring they would be implemented, then do nothing like that)
  • Do whatever was decided initially
  • Communicate AFTER having done what was initially decided, which creates a number of problems

:frusty:

The truth is so refreshing.

:worship:

#13 Nuno Brito

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 08:01 PM

Corporate experience shows: never change a brand name

Things change if you want to survive:
http://en.wikipedia....(search_engine)
http://en.wikipedia....Firefox#History

Heck, even WinBuilder changed name two times before settling on the current one you see today.. :worship:

Btw, I don't think this Board is about re-booting. It rather about having a boot choice for most if not all members and visitors with rarest exception. When looking to such major changes - that's where having Advisory Board would be quite handy.

Choices are always problematic. Albeit I agree with you, I can't let democracy to continue ruining all the good things that we have built over the years.

Take as example the Winbuilder civil war that flared earlier this year. Several key people were left with both responsibility and power to decide the fate of development and run our forum in a democratic fashion.

As result after an escalation of disputing arguments and no clear decisions, WinBuilder.exe development halted, scripts became unbearably heavy and complex, projects got abandoned or even removed from public sight as everything at the reach of opposing parties was used as ammunition to hurt the other party.

The only casualties from this conflict were end-users along with a general sense of distrust and animosity amongst developers. Time can only help to deal some of the damage but it won't close these wounds.

-------------

To halt aggressions, we moved from a state of peace keeping onto peace enforcement as last resort. For the first time since we founded this land, martial law was imposed. Conflicting members that fail to respect the imposed truce and offend the other parties, risked permanent ban and loss of all acquired rights regardless of their age or rank.


Despite the severity of this decision, no bans took place and animosity calmed.

Some of the most active members went to other lands in our boot disk neighborhood or even founded their own lands. After a while, these members might have concluded that things are not so green on the other side of the fence and returned onto our presence.

------

So, my decisions are not correct nor fair. But they are necessary to ensure that we keep moving forward.

This allows to trace a course of action for the future of our empire. Everyone (you included) has a chance of convincing me and the majority of people here to change this direction, whenever strong and solid arguments are presented to prove otherwise in a civilized manner.

At this moment, we are changing a lot of things around here and this is never easy. Some of these plans will stand the test of time as good ideas while others will not. There is a whole lot more involved than what people see on the surface or that can be expressed on a public forum.


Of course that this decision process is subject to a very partial perspective, but at least you know exactly what to expect and have better conditions to fight for your rights to be heard.

One day democracy or a advisory board will come along, just not today.

#14 grubstake

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 11:12 PM

Sambul, a domain can be moved to any server....so the cost of the server/serving-the-site has nothing to do with the choice of domain-name.

Nuno, mozilla only change firefox name because of pressure from group already using earlier name. What has that to do with boot-land? Do you say that you are under pressure from earlier user of 'boot-land' ?? If so, first I've heard of it.

I must admit I've not understand any of the 'reasons' for this change that have been listed. I mean, I get only a 'disconnect'.....as if the person was talking about apples and oranges in same sentence.

I've spent only .00001 of the time here that Jaclaz and others have, so apparently I've missed the threads about why ANY change/move was needed or desired.

Is there a commercial/profitability reason for it?

If so, then I think one should back up and not dismiss Sambul's words so lightly....for he is 100% correct in regards to brand-name value. It matters not how 'good' or 'stupid' a brand-name is....the key to value is how widely it is already recognized and known.

Take 'Kleenex'....if you -think- about it...examine it.....it is a really stooopid name!

Yet it became worth very much money for a long time.

If there is not any underlying money-driven reason for this change, then I am entirely baffled as to why it was thought needful/desirable -in the first place- to change the domain/board name. Changing the basic fundamental name of the place is just not something that ever would've occurred to me to do.

But again, I've not been privy to all the preceding threads/debates/notices....as I rarely get to visit here, or any other place on-line. I am a miner...so I am outdoors and 'up the mountain' away from any connection most of the time.

So since I -am- in such ignorance of all the background, and motivations (both voiced and perhaps unvoiced or not well-communicated as well), I'll shut up now....lol.

Edited by grubstake, 04 December 2010 - 11:15 PM.


#15 sambul61

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 11:21 PM

Nuno

The companies you referred to are well financed, have large stuff, incur significant costs, and try to improve profitability by repositioning themselves on the market. What it has to do with Boot Land? May be the only thing you need now is a good sponsor? Did you try to approach US Gov. from within the University asking to sponsor alternative R&D and organizational medium in boot methods? That's how Mozilla survived the worst years, and keep drawing from that source. In fact, they were directly encouraged to offer alternative browser solutions and funded to ensure that happen. Can you find a professor at your University interested in boot methods research and get him involved? The sponsorship will continue after you graduate, and you may be interested to continue your study as well.

It sounds a bit strange you talk about Boot Land survival, if you're. Yet changing its name may only facilitate the outcome you're trying to avoid. I agree, changing this Board's well recognized name would be the very last thing ever coming to mind as a necessity or grows stimulus. I would never agree on it, if it were mine. :worship: May be you view name change as the way to change how the Board is perceived by advertisers? But its subject matter itself doesn't attract ads, and this can't be changed (unless you plan to change the subject).

I guess I meant something different talking about Advisory Board. Meaning probably all decisions being made by civilized Board members consensus. Is it possible? Of course it is. Its kind of "normal" for creative ppl to tend overestimating their perceived "value" and opinions. This process is manageable. But again, it depends on how its organized, and I don't know people involved good enough.

Anyway, at the end of the day its up to you to decide. What I can say, your Board is important information and progress source in this narrow boot subject, and I found it personally very deep and helpful. :worship: And devotion of some ppl here to this subject, sharing knowledge and helping others is to some degree unique. Everyone can see that - don't loose this in reorganization efforts.

#16 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:08 AM

Heck, even WinBuilder changed name two times before settling on the current one you see today.. :worship:

Even then without an actual reason. :worship:

But changing the name of the main app is not like changing the name of the "brand".

Like if "Mr. Ford" decides, in one of the stupid attempts for politically correctness, and following one of the many scandals involving female escorts and politicians, to change the name of the best-selling car ever "Escort" to "Bodyguard" it will make it difficult, but not impossible, but if the actual brand name changes from "Ford" to, say, "Nixon", it would be tougher :smart:.


In any case Wonko approves :worship: that:
  • martial Law has been established (much better than no-law)
  • though completely wrong, Nuno does have a plan
  • that things (still as wrong as they may be) are actually decided and done

The only thing Wonko would like to see (and respectfully asks the Boss about) is that external links to "current" boot-land will not resolve in the future into "a suffusion of yellow", just like we have our good ol' invision board still available in "frozen" state, example:
http://z3.invisionfr...hp?showtopic=14

it would be nice to have the same for the "old" (in the future) boot-land.

:smart:
Wonko

#17 IgImAx

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 12:26 PM

Hi :worship:

. I hope all transfers done without any loses of those great posts!

Good Luck and Thanks!
IgImAx

#18 paraglider

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 02:12 PM

I agree that the war that developed between a small number of people in these forums had to be stopped. However I hope in the peace that follows that winbuilder does not stagnate and die.

#19 sambul61

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 04:15 PM

That's an interesting point to consider: quiet place without fight of opinions and compromises often results in stagnation. Ppl need some stimulus to work to the best of their abilities, and resolving controversies often adds needed creativity spirit.

While many say "make sure the links still work", I'd say it again - do not change the name in the first place. :worship:

#20 grubstake

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 07:37 PM

..... but if the actual brand name changes from "Ford" to, say, "Nixon", it would be tougher :frusty:.


:smart:

:worship: :smart:

:worship:

#21 Mikorist

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 12:43 PM

I have domain registered to a man who is not called Darth Vader - his name is Nuno Brito.

Name of domain is:

BootYou.com


.com is .com :frusty:


start the initial processes; "boot your computer" and BootYOU....


BootYOU... can create a totally unique, personalized boots. :hyper:


YOU have disease-causing viruses, and now BootYou out - you have no idea why?

Posted Image

go to BootYou.com

Untitled_3.jpg

:worship:

#22 homes32

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 03:58 PM

I agree with previous posters. the boot-land name is vary valuable and completely describes what goes on here. In my opinion it would be a big mistake to change it. My opinion. take it as it is.

with regard to color schemes. I find black on white pages hard to read for any longer period if time. one of the reasons I (with many others) still use the old Webber theme. very clear and readable, and easy on the eyes. and posts don't blur together.


I noticed that according to whois.net lookup the parked domain bootland.net name expires today. may be worth looking at if your looking drop the hyphen.

as for other short name enhancements the same mod rewrite can be used on current urls to achieve cleaner, friendlier urls. along with some DNS tinkering to achive a similar effect.



http://www.registry.pro/pro/eligibility.shtml

.PRO is an exclusive top-level domain reserved for use exclusively by licensed business and service professionals and entities internationally. All applicants meeting the following qualifications may register a .PRO domain name:

Provides professional services
Admitted to or licensed by a government certification body or jurisdictional licensing entity recognized by a governmental body that regularly verifies the accuracy of its data
In good standing with the licensing authority

In addition, registrants will be asked to provide the following information related to their professional eligibility:

Identification
Contact information
Profession-specific information such as license number

not sure that boot-land meets these requirements. we really don't provide professional services, even though the results of our efforts are used by professionals and created by professionals. I could be wrong. correct me if so.

#23 Nuno Brito

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 04:06 PM

Mikorist, as I've already mentioned by email: we remain with reboot.pro

I could be wrong. correct me if so.

I've already took care of the paperwork. We are recognized by the .pro entity as valid to use the domain name.

We move forward.

#24 Mikorist

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 04:21 PM

Mikorist, as I've already mentioned by email: we remain with reboot.pro



As You Wish, My Master :hyper:

you will have any help from me :worship:

#25 Galapo

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 09:10 PM

I also agree with Holmes32. I'd like to see the site stay at boot-land -- "reboot" has VERY negative connotations. And white background is makes the site hard on the eyes and unpleasant. So I'd also like to see the webber theme available for use, or the default theme modified as per Jaclaz's suggestions.

Regards,
Galapo.




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