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#1 MedEvil

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 04:18 PM

Finally managed to get my hands on a copy of the Win7PE distributed by the german computer magazine c't.
Unfortunately only on a prebuild iso and not the actual scripts.

It's not an idependantly developed Win7PE, but a renamed VistaPE.
It requires at least 750MB RAM, comes with BS-Explorer as shell and interesting few apps for its size.

Just in case, anyone else also wondered.


:cheers:

#2 homes32

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 06:15 PM

Finally managed to get my hands on a copy of the Win7PE distributed by the german computer magazine c't.
Unfortunately only on a prebuild iso and not the actual scripts.

It's not an idependantly developed Win7PE, but a renamed VistaPE.
It requires at least 750MB RAM, comes with BS-Explorer as shell and interesting few apps for its size.

Just in case, anyone else also wondered.


:cheers:

and by interesting few apps that means about 5. I was not impressed, considering the size of the ISO. but yeah. basically VistaPE built with Waik 2.1

#3 budd

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 09:34 AM

the 2011 cc7pe ct notfall windows can be found here

Edited by Nuno Brito, 04 August 2011 - 01:16 PM.
removed links


#4 Nuno Brito

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 01:20 PM

Hi Budd,

Welcome to Reboot!

I appreciate the links and would love to try out the image to get an idea of what was done, but it is copyrighted material and we shouldn't have links to download their image without express permission from C'T.

In either case, this is the cover from this month's edition:
Posted Image

The article mentioning WinBuilder can be read at page 118: http://www.heise.de/...alt/2011/17/118

:hyper:

#5 pecd.net

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 02:00 PM

Hey guys,

from your point of view i am well aware that the cc7pe does not offer anything new, but it is quite far from VistaPE (if you did not see the build environment you will probably not notice)...

And there is one important factor to this: all WB PE projects i have seen can not easily be published (due to copyright troubles)...very long story...

Years ago i started a thread here listing those for VistaPE...

So i am sure it is nothing that will make you guys happy, but it works for most users and can be published to our terms...

#6 sbaeder

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 03:06 PM

Re: Copyrights and general 'good netizen' behavior

I appreciate the links and would love to try out the image to get an idea of what was done, but it is copyrighted material and we shouldn't have links to download their image without express permission from C'T.

The article mentioning WinBuilder can be read at page 118: http://www.heise.de/...alt/2011/17/118

Yep - links to things that anyone can just "get" by following public pointers (like the actual article) are fine, but anything else really needs to be carefully considered. As a collection, they do "own" the copyright on the collection, so being mindful of that is a good thing.

from your point of view i am well aware that the cc7pe does not offer anything new, but it is quite far from VistaPE (if you did not see the build environment you will probably not notice)...

And there is one important factor to this: all WB PE projects i have seen can not easily be published (due to copyright troubles)...very long story...

Years ago i started a thread here listing those for VistaPE...

So i am sure it is nothing that will make you guys happy, but it works for most users and can be published to our terms...

Again, we should all strive to make sure even the projects and scripts we create and package up are "clean" w.r.t. the strictest terms and conditions - even if the country the author lives in doesn't have the same restrictive rules.

For example, I have been recently looking at the "Areo and Control Panel" script inside Win7PE_SE. It contains a modified executable that "belongs" to Microsoft. To make Aero work in a PE, the standard one needs a minor tweak. It is almost just as easy to provide the tool to make the tweak on the fly - and NOT redistribute MSoft code as it is to just hack it once and distribute the modified version. One way is "OK", the other isn't, since we don't have the right to redistribute modified MS code.

These are the simple changes that don't take much effort, and can make things better...

Anyway, enough on that - congradulations to the whole 'ct team on this project and update...

:hyper:
Scott

#7 al_jo

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 03:19 PM

There is another "version" here:
http://pcwelt-praxis...ds/pcwwin7pe-r2

#8 MedEvil

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 03:48 PM

@pecd.net
The first 2 posts of this topic are over a year old! :hyper:

Still would be nice if you could give some details of things you improved.

@sbaeder

Again, we should all strive to make sure even the projects and scripts we create and package up are "clean" w.r.t. the strictest terms and conditions - even if the country the author lives in doesn't have the same restrictive rules.

That's ridiculous! You can't create a WB project, that will not violate any law in any country on this planet.

For instance your idea of ditributing a patch instead of a patched exe.
Maybe legal in your country, it is not in Germany. Distribution of software that is meant to circumvent any restriction, that the rights owner has inplemented, is illegal.
So here in Germany, you can't cover your behind and shift the legal repercussions to the enduser.
Even if you would distribute the patch as a tutorial. You still break the law.

With just the US and the German law applying together at the same time to WB, we're already pretty screwed. Add laws from a couple of hundred countries more and you will have successfully have closed any loopholes that allow Wb to exist.


btw. Just for the record. To be 100% legal and not getting sued, are two totally different things, which have nothing to do with eachother.


;)

#9 pecd.net

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 05:09 PM

@pecd.net
The first 2 posts of this topic are over a year old! ;)


Ohhh...shame on me for not noticing :whistling:


Still would be nice if you could give some details of things you improved.


Well, to be honest i can not completely remember the state of the last version two years ago, but here are some points:

  • this package is only very loosely based on vistape, but almost every aspect has been reworked
  • it tries to be api complient for the app scripts
  • it uses several cool scripts from this forum with permission from their authors (i hope i asked everyone who had to be asked, it is sometimes hard to find out who is responsible)
  • it is as "legal" as possible so that i can be published on the magazine DVD
  • a download version is not possible as some permissions prohibt a download version
  • i will try to offer a reduced download version if i can find the time (in a few weeks maybe if you guys keep asking:-))
  • it has some features that most 7pe version i came around do not have:

  • for maximum comaptibillity it does not create the pe by collectiong files, but rather copies the whole MS PE and then strips it down to save size (but i agree it is still quite big)
  • it can set the winbuilder task priority for the build to speed up building
  • it does several checks to make sure the hosOS meets all needed criteria (The "Check basics" script)
  • it offers profiles so you can define for example a profile for minimal build and one for normal, one for maximum and one for you preferred and easily swith between them
  • it offers a build cache so that build will be faster (about a year ago peter an i had the same idea almost at the same time and implemented something like this independetly)
  • it has an imporved peloader with lots of options not in the offical version (also included is password protection and the pe can "expire" if you want it)
  • it does not use waik at all (no need to download or install and also no need for wimgapi or other dlls from waik)
  • The c't edition comes (with permission) with some nice apps like a "drive snapshot" version that works 12 months free of charge, and also several EASEUS tools, Chrome, Firefox and Thunderbird, ESET Online Scanner script as well as the full ESET Scanner (login needed for update which was provided by c't a few magazines ago).
  • I can offer a GDATA AVK 2012 script if someone is interested, it did not find its way int the pe
[/list]
The more interesting part will probably be the Multiboot part. This is a project completely independent from the PE and it integrates a lot of well known boot disks into one grub4dos based multiboot disk or USB Stick (see attached pic)

For many of you all this might not sound very cool, but as i said before, most of the work is making it "legal" and also making it work for normal users which never made a pe before.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Clipboard01.jpg


#10 pecd.net

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 05:17 PM

Anyway, enough on that - congradulations to the whole 'ct team on this project and update...


Well, thanks, but i am just a one man show...no team:-)

#11 MedEvil

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 05:42 PM

it has an imporved peloader with lots of options not in the offical version (also included is password protection and the pe can "expire" if you want it)

Now that sounds cool. Any chance you make this improved loader available here?

:whistling:

#12 pecd.net

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 06:02 PM

to use the script you also need hwpnp files and devcon.exe

the script might not work in any of the public projects without some work...i only use it in my project...

i attached the loader and the script here...maybe it helps some of you, but i have to admit there is still a lot that could have been done...no time:-(

Attached Thumbnails

  • Clipboard02.jpg
  • Clipboard03.jpg
  • Clipboard04.jpg

Attached Files



#13 sbaeder

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 08:31 PM

That's ridiculous! You can't create a WB project, that will not violate any law in any country on this planet.

That's why I said "strive"... :whistling:

For instance your idea of distributing a patch instead of a patched exe.
Maybe legal in your country, it is not in Germany. Distribution of software that is meant to circumvent any restriction, that the rights owner has implemented, is illegal.

I guess it all depends on if it is considered a "restriction", since in USA, the infamous DMCA also could come into play.

btw. Just for the record. To be 100% legal and not getting sued, are two totally different things, which have nothing to do with each other.

;)

How true, how true...My intent was just to echo the lament of pecd.net on the difficulties of being able to commercially provide a project and the pitfalls that may come up.

:cheers:

#14 sbaeder

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 08:47 PM

a download version is not possible as some permissions prohibit a download version

Is the Mag easily available in the US? Single copy purchase?

i will try to offer a reduced download version if i can find the time (in a few weeks maybe if you guys keep asking:-))

it has some features that most 7pe version i came around do not have:

  • for maximum comaptibillity it does not create the pe by collectiong files, but rather copies the whole MS PE and then strips it down to save size (but i agree it is still quite big)
  • it can set the winbuilder task priority for the build to speed up building
  • it does several checks to make sure the hosOS meets all needed criteria (The "Check basics" script)
  • it offers profiles so you can define for example a profile for minimal build and one for normal, one for maximum and one for you preferred and easily swith between them
  • it offers a build cache so that build will be faster (about a year ago peter an i had the same idea almost at the same time and implemented something like this independetly)
  • it has an imporved peloader with lots of options not in the offical version (also included is password protection and the pe can "expire" if you want it)
  • it does not use waik at all (no need to download or install and also no need for wimgapi or other dlls from waik)


Even without any APPS (just your own creations), would be good stuff to look at and learn from.

The more interesting part will probably be the Multiboot part. This is a project completely independent from the PE and it integrates a lot of well known boot disks into one grub4dos based multiboot disk or USB Stick (see attached pic)


To avoid confusion with MultiBoot (i.s. supports different source OS, like Vista OR Win7), it is good you clarified that it is a Multi-OS additiotn. While we haven't gotten it all documented, we are trying to work on some standard for the variables so that just like scripts, "OtherOS" scripts can be more easily shared. Hope to have more of it better documented soon, but for now, see the examples in the current Win7PE_SE update on how they added the variables to the project, and re-read them in, etc.

Again, thanks
Scott

#15 pscEx

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 10:40 PM

To avoid confusion with MultiBoot (i.s. supports different source OS, like Vista OR Win7), it is good you clarified that it is a Multi-OS additiotn.

Thanks, Scott, for the clarification.:whistling:

Maybe we internally have to clarify something else:
What you call "Multiboot", is logically "Multi-OS".

But what you mean with "MultiBoot", is "MultiPE" (and there is a special subforum for it)

IMO there currently exist only two projects building from different sources:
  • MultiPE Leopard by Max_Real Qnx
  • nativeEx_multiPE by me
Peter

#16 pecd.net

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 05:49 AM

Thanks, Scott, for the clarification.:whistling:

Maybe we internally have to clarify something else:
What you call "Multiboot", is logically "Multi-OS".

But what you mean with "MultiBoot", is "MultiPE" (and there is a special subforum for it)

IMO there currently exist only two projects building from different sources:

  • MultiPE Leopard by Max_Real Qnx
  • nativeEx_multiPE by me
Peter


Yes, sorry for the confusion...

Everything i call multiboot means a grub4dos based boot disk/stick with several bootdisks in one grub4dos menu
The PE is built from win7 x86 only (sorry no x64 support in this release)

#17 sbaeder

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 05:13 PM

Maybe what we should say is Multi-Source...Since it is applying to the project input, and Multi-Boot means a grub (OR ISOLinux/Syslinux/Windows BCD/etc.) boot menu that is produced...

IS that OK with everyone?

#18 pecd.net

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 05:16 PM

That the way i see it...

#19 pscEx

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 05:56 PM

Let me try to repeat for the record:

MultiPE > One project can use different sources to build the target PE
Multi-Boot: > A collection of independent bootable items (PE, Application, ThirdParty ISO, ...) managed by a boot manager (Grub4Dos, ???, ...)
Multi-Source > Several bootable items combined into ONE final PE (I'm not sure to have understood this correctly. IMO that is not possible)

Peter

If not correct, please do not reply. Just edit here and correct.

#20 pecd.net

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 06:11 PM

As i can not edit in News i have to reply.-)

MultiPE=Multi-Source > One project can use different sources to build the target PE

#21 budd

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 06:24 PM

Hi Budd,

Welcome to Reboot!

I appreciate the links and would love to try out the image to get an idea of what was done, but it is copyrighted material and we shouldn't have links to download their image without express permission from C'T.


shame but you are right, better to keep the forum out of harms way. actually it was two downloads - the scripts&tools and a readymade image. but anyway, it is probably not illegal to mention that people interested to talk about it can send me a private message.

thanks for the projects and the works you guys put in it.. bud

#22 sbaeder

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 06:32 PM

As i can not edit in News i have to reply.-)

MultiPE=Multi-Source > One project can use different sources to build the target PE

Agree, and since multiPE is to many ambiguous, saying Multi-Boot or Multi-Source is clearer (IMNSHO)...

But I agree that MultiPE should be taken to mean Multi-Source and we use Multi-Boot if it refers to boot loaders and such.

#23 woicbhr

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Posted 28 October 2011 - 02:25 PM

Hello,
is there any way to start the creation process via comandline ?
I already did:
WinBuilder.exe /run="C:ctNotWin2011Projectscc7pescript.project"
but it just ran into a fullscreen window with 5 Buttons at the top labeled:
Interface editor, Description, Attachments, Options, Source
following the label Source.

Any ideas ?

Edited by woicbhr, 28 October 2011 - 02:27 PM.


#24 sbaeder

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Posted 28 October 2011 - 06:08 PM

I think by default, WinBuilder just goes into the "editor" mode if you ask it to open a project file like that. There was another similar post last night as well asking if there are switches that can be used to just execute a project. I think not, but "pscEx" may have to correct (or confim) this.

Just thinking out loud on some of the issues...for example, Since there could be more than one "project", it might have to rely on settings in the INI file as well as settings in the specific project (like source to be used)...




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