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WinBuilder 080


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#51 Lancelot

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 12:10 PM

I have had the luck that most of those scripts i made myself have worked with the new versions, but that's probobly because they most of the time are pretty simple. :lol:

yep, application scripts mostly not effected (but also check your filecopy routines if exists since a bug fixed with this version not allowing old bugy behaviour). Sadly the history notes (ex: History_080.txt) do not include very clean instructions (yes, requested.. :rolleyes:) for the ones who want to revise his/her informations.

That is the reason (I believe) some of our advanced script writers (with their limited time) come to boot-land only to see what is going.

I also wonder, if the revised version has a tag or something in the program that makes the user know if he/she runs this fixed version ?

nope, I guess you understand my plan from previous codes. ;) (if it is working without critical bug)
+ Galapo's request on previous post also requested by Galapo before.

What I ment with the beta section is, that it would be better to release more betas for the public to test, to ensure that when going final most of the things works as expected.

It was experienced before going public that way results things development (psc) do not like to for a set of reasons. I disagreed with the decision (which cause LiveXP stuck with 077rc2 for a long while as expected (and written)), and after a while another development model created which i call "silent public". It means things you reported on topics fixed silently (and you get a reply on topic that it is fixed) without causing things developers do not like.

Since there is no practical difference for the improvement between 2 models, I like both. And since development like the 2nd way, why not . But 2nd model caused bad development behaviour of release decision more critical for all.

1 change made on development model in 080 release, development asked advanced users and project admins to test before publish (in a hidden topic). That is the reason 080 (rev1 or 2) become that much nice.

But they continued their release behaviour (verrry unexpectadly, but maybe we should expect :rolleyes: ) which make 080 release born death.

Even now, with last posts, you can notice development insists on not taking lessons from past experiences (even 3 days before).

:rolleyes:

#52 paraglider

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 01:31 PM

win7pe project fails to build. Generates a Halt during explorer shell script. However if I enable debug logging it works.

Don't know what version of 080 I am using. I downloaded it today. Maybe the latest. Maybe not. No way to know.

#53 PaPeuser

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 01:43 PM

win7pe project fails to build. Generates a Halt during explorer shell script. However if I enable debug logging it works.

Don't know what version of 080 I am using. I downloaded it today. Maybe the latest. Maybe not. No way to know.



Are you using the update package or new download from WB 8

Edited
This happen to me to,
When I put newer WB 8 in an existing build, with the updated
(Unofficial Win7 package from yahoouk).

I had a few errors scripts that updated from internet to a temp file failed
And I also had the Explorer shell error.

So with that build I went back to WB 78sp6 and Started a new build with WB 8

So far all is ok,,,, But i will stop at this point till WB 82 comes out

#54 MedEvil

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 01:44 PM

Don't know what version of 080 I am using. I downloaded it today. Maybe the latest. Maybe not. No way to know.

Just look at the date of the exe in the archive. Is this so hard?
More annoying is, that again it was not posted that an update was available! :lol:

btw. Thanks Lancelot for letting us know. ;)

:rolleyes:

#55 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 02:22 PM

Just look at the date of the exe in the archive. Is this so hard?

No, I do have the date before me, too bad that ALL references till now include NOT the date, such as:
  • Version 80 (no date)
  • Version 80 enhanced (no date)
  • Version 80 silently updated (no date)
  • Version 80 rev 1 (no date)
  • Version 80 rev 2 (no date)
  • ....
or include the date, but not the corresponding version:
  • 2010-Feb-23 16:06

and it also seems that we need to have our clocks syncronized and use a resolution of seconds to know which is the latest (ore the one before latest or the one before the one that was once the one before the latest) :rolleyes:

:lol:

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#56 MedEvil

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 02:38 PM

There have been only 3 versions.
The initial release on Friday, Rev1 on Sunday and Rev2 today.
The initial release will cause troubles with some specitic registry operations. Definitly not recommended for PE1 projects, no idea about PE2/3.
Rev1. Great and stable version with, to my knowledge, only 1 minor issue, which only developers will ever notice, if that.
Rev2. No improvements or changes for the general user. Just the above issue is fixed now.

:lol:

#57 Lancelot

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 03:00 PM

win7pe project fails to build. Generates a Halt during explorer shell script. However if I enable debug logging it works.

Don't know what version of 080 I am using. I downloaded it today. Maybe the latest. Maybe not. No way to know.


no suprise to me,

Interesting part is, when debug log enabled this bug do not happen. (and debug log and normal log should not have a difference on the build but only on log !!!! edit: I do not know to give a reproducable example, I noticed that with my RF tests. When i enabled debug log, rf worked !!)

and i never could find time to check other PE builds, and could not report to bug tracker without having a reproducable method without having time.

but for that case I feel a workaround can be produced , can be ???

and reminding, It was already known before (when first annoucned publishing which was not a good release as 080 rev2) development likes Las Vegas style for release

Happy gambling as usual. Probably forgotten, it was written before

Sorry for spending lots of time on this, I totally understand the intentions of this topic wrongly. If I knew I would not spend all these times. As usual please do as you like. If new version is good and no critical reports made within 2 weeks, naturally livexp will have next version. :lol:

but house always wins :rolleyes:

#58 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 03:19 PM

no suprise to me,
and i never could find time to check other PE builds, and could not report to bug tracker without having a reproducable method without having time.


A completely fictitious reply from the developers :lol::

Actually you don't want to report it to the bug-tracker it is by design.

You see, since we are not that sure that newbies are confused enough by version numbering, undocumented syntax, queer behaviours of the app without any logical explanation, and what not, we added this feature, this way an experienced user will have the program work whilst the newbie, which surely would never turn debug log on, will have the same version (which he won't be able to report) NOT working on a given project, so when he posts for help, everyone will be entitled to give random suggestions, like "redownload the whole package", "disable your antivirus and firewall", "update to last version of Winbuilder" (the latter rigorously WITHOUT giving a link to where to get it).
The side effect (judge yourself if a positive effect or "collateral damage") is that this way we can give Wonko the Sane another occasion to show himself as the grumpy dinosaur that strongly criticizes this new, modern approach to write friendly applications and makes some easy humour by mocking us.


:rolleyes:

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#59 Lancelot

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 03:33 PM

A completely fictitious reply from the developers :rolleyes::

why reply adress to me :lol:

I already requested log file improvements
http://www.boot-land...amp;showbug=237

and i never wanted debug log, sadly when debug log first introduced I was the only one (alone) who was against it, sadly neither anonymous nor nonymous :rolleyes: member support by decision.

#60 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 03:37 PM

why reply adress to me :rolleyes:

I wasn't addressing it to you. :lol:

paraglider showed some surprise :rolleyes: , you said that it was not a surprise ;) , but apparently failed to explain the reason why this feature was implemented :rolleyes:, I tried to fill this gap. ;)

;)

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#61 PaPeuser

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 04:04 PM

So your saying all this NEWBEE had to do was enable debug....................

#62 paraglider

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 12:46 AM

I have no idea what the conclusion from all the above posts was. Its expected that you have to switch on debug logging for a project to compile?

Don't know why every time a new version is uploaded to the public downloads that at least the internal file version of winbuilder cannot be changed.

#63 paraglider

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 12:51 AM

Also cannot reproduce the problem any more even with the debugging log switched off. Changed nothing but its now working ok.

#64 Galapo

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 02:52 AM

Don't know why every time a new version is uploaded to the public downloads that at least the internal file version of winbuilder cannot be changed.

That's what I would like too. It would help in these cases where silent updates occur and working out which version is being used.

Regards,
Galapo.

#65 Nuno Brito

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 04:17 AM

That's what I would like too. It would help in these cases where silent updates occur and working out which version is being used.


That's a good suggestion.

Please add it on the wishlist:
http://www.boot-land...hp?showforum=99

:lol:

#66 paraglider

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 12:36 PM

Done.

http://www.boot-land...?...c=10517&hl=

#67 MedEvil

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 04:02 PM

Since the post has been removed, i state it's contensts again.

The search forward button does not work in WB080.


As a workaround, one can still use the search backward button.

But i really like to ask our development team the question, how it is possible that sooooooooooooooooooo many of the features that worked already fine previously, got broken in this version?
Imo, rewriting WB from scratch, couldn't have created more havoc. :exclamation:

:exclamation:

#68 Lancelot

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 04:21 PM

As a workaround, one can still use the search backward button.

Thanks, very more easier workaround than opening notepad :exclamation:. :exclamation:

just a reminder. It was found before 080 released during development, was working with "080 initial" , was working with "080 rev1" , than again not working with "080 rev2"

From my side, I truely understand how these can happen, but sadly nobody asks to check these Medusa Posted Image issues from testers.

Posted Image Posted Image

#69 MedEvil

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 04:54 PM

It was found before 080 released during development, was working with "080 initial" , was working with "080 rev1" , than again not working with "080 rev2"

Oh boy! That's even worst than i thought! While fixing a simple layout problem in the interface editor, the search button in the source editor got broken? :exclamation:

But good to hear, in a way :cheers:, i was already blaming myself for somehow missing this, while testing the interface prior to the initial release of WB080.

:exclamation:

#70 Nuno Brito

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:01 PM

Hi guys.

Since the post has been removed, i state it's contensts again.


The report from Max was placed on it's own topic here:
http://www.boot-land...showtopic=10544

Please add your comments there so that we can keep track of this bug while working on the new version.

But good to hear, in a way, i was already blaming myself for somehow missing this, while testing the interface prior to the initial release of WB080.

We'll be trying to ensure that a more thorough testing is followed, a test project and test cases will likely be made available as soon as possible.

In fact, you can start a new topic on the wishlist section and add a test case for validating the source editor buttons before a release is made: http://www.boot-land...hp?showforum=96


Thanks.

#71 pscEx

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:19 PM

Since the post has been removed, i state it's contensts again.



As a workaround, one can still use the search backward button.

But i really like to ask our development team the question, how it is possible that sooooooooooooooooooo many of the features that worked already fine previously, got broken in this version?
Imo, rewriting WB from scratch, couldn't have created more havoc. :exclamation:

:exclamation:


Simply because in the Interface / Edit part (one module 'Pluginedit') I (from SVN server) went back to the stage before Nuno introduced the bug with disappearing component name and tooltip entry box.
In this old module I rebuilt all the additions of the between time.

And sorry, I forgot the "search forward".

Peter

#72 pscEx

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:24 PM

just a reminder. It was found before 080 released during development, was working with "080 initial" , was working with "080 rev1" , than again not working with "080 rev2"

http://www.boot-land...?...ost&p=92706

Peter

#73 MedEvil

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:36 PM

Hi guys.
The report from Max was placed on it's own topic here:
http://www.boot-land...showtopic=10544

I know.

Please add your comments there so that we can keep track of this bug while working on the new version.

I explicitly did not write into that topic, since you've said, you hate it if bugs are mentioned in big long threads. Besides a bugtracker does not seem the right place for a discussion.


In fact, you can start a new topic on the wishlist section and add a test case for validating the source editor buttons before a release is made:

You've gotta be kidding! Should i make an entry in your wishlist for every single button, i wish to work in the next version of WB?
And what would it be good for? I've checked the user interface and all buttons prior to release of WB080 and all the problems i found got fixed, now some are back again. :exclamation:


My wish for santa would be, that you start figuring out, how it is possible that every fix always spawns a cascade of other bugs, not seldom in areas that are not even connected.


:exclamation:

#74 Wonko the Sane

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:55 PM

I explicitly did not write into that topic, since you've said, you hate it if bugs are mentioned in big long threads. Besides a bugtracker does not seem the right place for a discussion.

That's no problem, the new bugtracker is not actually a bug tracker, is a discussion Forum allright. :exclamation:



You've gotta be kidding! Should i make an entry in your wishlist for every single button, i wish to work in the next version of WB?

Yes, this way you show your partecipation. :cheers:



I've checked the user interface and all buttons prior to release of WB080 ...

Really? :exclamation:


My wish for santa would be, that you start figuring out, how it is possible that every fix always spawns a cascade of other bugs, not seldom in areas that are not even connected.


Instead of sending a letter to the North Pole, you should do what you are normally told:

That's a good suggestion.

Please add it on the wishlist:
http://www.boot-land...hp?showforum=99


:cheers:

Wonko

#75 Nuno Brito

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 07:15 PM

You've gotta be kidding! Should i make an entry in your wishlist for every single button, i wish to work in the next version of WB?


My excuses if I wasn't clear, what I said was:

You can start a new topic on the wishlist section and add a test case for validating the source editor buttons before a release is made


It's not an entry for a single button, it's a request for wb developers to create a test case (or document a procedure) to check all buttons before releasing a stable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test_case

I will be creating a list of test cases that need to be validated before releasing a new wb. This will be meant as a guideline for everyone interested in testing to follow.

There is a need for testing the buttons on the interface and we need more suggestions like that.

---------------------------------------

I explicitly did not write into that topic, since you've said, you hate it if bugs are mentioned in big long threads. Besides a bugtracker does not seem the right place for a discussion.

Bugs listed on big long threads get forgotten or only read by a few. On the lack of a better place, they're the most adequate place to discuss them instead of keeping a discussion here and the bug report somewhere else. This is exactly the type of things that we are trying to improve.

My wish for santa would be, that you start figuring out, how it is possible that every fix always spawns a cascade of other bugs, not seldom in areas that are not even connected.

It's simple. There exists a lack of efficient communication or documented procedures regarding how development should take place.


That's no problem, the new bugtracker is not actually a bug tracker, is a discussion Forum allright.

Sure, but where is the bug tracker for MBRBatch?
http://www.boot-land...?showtopic=3191

If you want to talk about bug trackers I'd suggest you to give the example in your own projects instead of babbling about the ideal way how other projects should be working to get themselves organized.

Thank you.




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