21 replies to this topic

[shamurshamur]

i have installed grub4dos to mbr of my first hard disk and copied the file grldr and menu.lst to the root of the windows 7 partition.

when i boot my pc , i get the grub4dos menu instantly. but when i choose the option find and load BOOTMGR of Windows VISTA , there is a blank screen with white cursor blinking for about 10 seconds. And then windows 7 boot screen appears.

what's the problem??
ps:
Two weeks ago i had installed ubuntu 9.10 in dual boot configuration with windows 7.(using grub2 as bootloader)
Same problem was occurring back then.

[was_jaclaz]

Are you using the "default" menu.lst entry?

I mean, the one that ships with grub4dos?

# This is a sample menu.lst file. You should make some changes to it.
# The old install method of booting via the stage-files has been removed.
# Please install GRLDR boot strap code to MBR with the bootlace.com
# utility under DOS/Win9x or Linux.
.....
title find and load BOOTMGR of Windows VISTA
fallback 2
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /bootmgr
map () (hd0)
map (hd0) ()
map --rehook
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /bootmgr
chainloader /bootmgr
savedefault --wait=2
.....

That one is (unneededly) complex for "normal" use.

Try either:

title find and load BOOTMGR of Windows VISTA
find --set-root /bootmgr
chainloader /bootmgr

title Load BOOTMGR of Windows VISTA
root (hd0,0)
chainloader /bootmgr

(change (hd0,0) to the (hdm,n) where the install is.

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Hi jaclaz , thanks for reply.

i have already tried the entries you mentioned , problem remains the same............... Cursor blinking for 10 seconds before the boot screen appears.

one of my sample entries:

chainloader (hd0,0)/bootmgr

i have two harddisks.My windows 7 partition is (hd0,0). i have no other OS installed.i have also tried booting grub4dos from cd and then booting the bootmgr file from commandline of grub4dos.

chainloader (hd0,0)/bootmgr

i play around a lot with PBR and MBR of my hardisks .................. trying different bootloaders........sometimes dual booting with linux distros which installs their own bootloaders.And then deleting linux partition and restoring windows 7 boot sectors by using:

bootrec /fixmbrbootrec /fixboot

After fixing my MBR and PBR using these command , i am able to boot in windows 7 but then my cursor blinks for whole 30 SECONDS!!!!when i installs grub4dos to mbr i reduce the time of cursor blinking from 30 to 10 seconds.

i have checked the bootmgr file of windows 7 partition file using hash checksum . it is the same file which is in windows7 DVD.

is there any hope?

[was_jaclaz]

After fixing my MBR and PBR using these command , i am able to boot in windows 7 but then my cursor blinks for whole 30 SECONDS!!!!

when i installs grub4dos to mbr i reduce the time of cursor blinking from 30 to 10 seconds.

Something that you completely failed to report previously, just to make things easier in trying and helping you.
You effectively depicted grub4dos as being the problem instead of it being a (very partial ) solution.

i have checked the bootmgr file of windows 7 partition file using hash checksum . it is the same file which is in windows7 DVD.

is there any hope?

Really cannot say , it sounds more to me like a Hard Disk problem.

Please follow me:

1) When you boot with "normal" MBR and "normal" bootsector you go like this:
BIOS->HD access->MBR->HD access ->PBR ->HD access -> Filesystem access -> BOOTMGR

2) When you boot with grub4dos MBR chainloading directly BOOTMGR, you go like this:
BIOS->HD access->grub4dos MBR->HD access ->grub4dos filesystem access -> BOOTMGR

If #1 takes 30 seconds and #2 takes 10, it could mean that bypassing the intermediate steps and having less HD accesses could be the thing speeding it up.

Try 3rd way:
3) When you boot with grub4dos MBR chainloading "normal" PBR, you go like this:
BIOS->HD access->grub4dos MBR->HD access ->PBR ->HD access -> Filesystem access -> BOOTMGR

title Load whatever from first disk/first partition
root (hd0,0)
chainloader +1

What happens?

How long does it take?

Please also note that installing grub4dos MBR and using bootrec /fixmbr and bootrec /fixboot you don't change possible "wrong" DATA that may be in the MBR or the bootsector.

I would try running Chkdisk, first thing and the hard disk manufacturer test/diagnosing utility second.

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Something that you completely failed to report previously, just to make things easier in trying and helping you.

OOPS!!! Sorry for that.

Try 3rd way:
3) When you boot with grub4dos MBR chainloading "normal" PBR, you go like this:
BIOS->HD access->grub4dos MBR->HD access ->PBR ->HD access -> Filesystem access -> BOOTMGR
QUOTE
title Load whatever from first disk/first partition
root (hd0,0)
chainloader +1


What happens?

How long does it take?

I tried this way and this time it takes about 21 seconds.

Please also note that installing grub4dos MBR and using bootrec /fixmbr and bootrec /fixboot you don't change possible "wrong" DATA that may be in the MBR or the bootsector.

Can you please tell me more about this.
what does bootrec /fixmbr and bootrec /fixboot actually do.

And how should i fix this "wrong DATA "?

I would try running Chkdisk, first thing and the hard disk manufacturer test/diagnosing utility second.

i tried chkdisk on windows 7 partition , nothing wrong was reported( i tried both options Automatically file system errors and scan for and attempt recovery of bad sectors)

i have 250GB SATA2 SEAGATE hardrive.
i am now going to try "hard disk manufacturer test/diagnosing utility"

what do you suggest?

[karyonix]

• Is it possible that other disks cause slow loading of BCD ?
  Do you have other disks or storage devices connected to your computer ?
  Do they have problems such as slow starting or bad sectors ?
• Make sure your BCD store in in good condition.
  Have you tried bootrec /RebuildBcd?

[shamurshamur]

Hi karyonix,

Do you have other disks or storage devices connected to your computer ?

i have two hardisks and one DVD writer.
First hardisk have windows 7 on first partition. second hardisk don't have any OS.
i also have a USB mouse and a USB data cable for my mobile . i once tried detaching both of them. No improvement.

Do they have problems such as slow starting or bad sectors ?

No , i don't find any bad sectors when i check it with chkdsk.
Also once my windows 7 boot screen appears , windows loads pretty fast after that.

i don't see any sign like slow speed or any filesystem error after windows 7 has been booted. Everything works fast and smoothly.

Make sure your BCD store in in good condition.
Have you tried bootrec /RebuildBcd?

i have tried bootrec /rebuildbcd.
Problem remains the same.

[karyonix]

Try " geometry --sync " in GRUB4DOS commandline.

[shamurshamur]

Try " geometry --sync " in GRUB4DOS commandline.

i tried this .
No progress

[was_jaclaz]

Something that may worth a try would be creating two boot floppy images, one with just grub4dos, and one along the lines of the "Vista boot floppy" (7 should be the same):
http://www.multiboot....uk/floppy.html

If you have a floppy drive, good, otherwise put them on a bootable device, like CD or USB stick, and see what happens.

If the PC is booted from this "other media", you can bypass both the MBR code and the PBR code, and also the actual /boot/BCD on the hard disk.

However it is really "strange" what you report.


What happened with the manufacturer hard disk diagnose/test app?
About this:

First hardisk have windows 7 on first partition. second hardisk don't have any OS.

Physically disconnect the second hard disk.

Jolt down all the settings you have in your BIOS.

See if you have an option like "Reset Configuration data" in it, or however choose "Load failsafe settings" (or the equivalnt in your BIOS) nad se if anything changes.

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Something that may worth a try would be creating two boot floppy images, one with just grub4dos, and one along the lines of the "Vista boot floppy" (7 should be the same):
http://www.multiboot....uk/floppy.html

so i made a boot cd by using bootmgr file and BCD file from my windows 7 partition.
when i booted from the cd , it takes 10 seconds for BCD menu to show up.

sensing something wrong with BCD file, i rebuild the BCD file by using bootrec /rebuildbcd and then again made a boot cd using bootmgr and BCD files from windows 7 partition.
same 10 seconds were taken for BCD menu to show up.

i think something wrong with the BCD file.

[was_jaclaz]

i think something wrong with the BCD file.

Try making a BRAND new BCD file, then.

The 10 seconds from CD may be due to other reasons , but try the BRAND new BCD from CD, and then try it on HD.

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Try making a BRAND new BCD file, then.

How to make this "BRAND new BCD" .
i have already tried using bootrec /rebuildbcd to build new BCD. situation remains the same for both cd and hardisk. its still taking 10 seconds for BCD menu to appear.

i have also tried the cd in Vmware , the BCD menu is appearing instantly. but when i boot my pc from that cd , it takes 10 seconds for BCD menu to appear.

[was_jaclaz]

i think something wrong with the BCD file.

Try making a BRAND new BCD file, then.

How to make this "BRAND new BCD" .

Waiter come taste this soup.....
http://www.imdb.com/...98/crazycredits
Aha. Aha! ...

I'll try again.

....

.... it sounds more to me like a Hard Disk problem.

....
I would try running Chkdisk, first thing and the hard disk manufacturer test/diagnosing utility second.

....
Physically disconnect the second hard disk.

Jolt down all the settings you have in your BIOS.

See if you have an option like "Reset Configuration data" in it, or however choose "Load failsafe settings" (or the equivalnt in your BIOS) nad se if anything changes.

The general idea is:

• a user asks for help
• someone tries to help him suggesting one or more steps/attemtps to take/do
• the user does EXACTLY AND EVERYTHING has been suggested and reports what happens

The above as opposed to:

• a user asks for help
• someone tries to help him suggesting one or more steps/attemtps to take/do
• the user does just one of the suggested things or does instead a completely different one and/or fails to report the results of what has been suggested

Try comparing the above with the "common sense advice" attached to Rules:
http://www.boot-land...?act=boardrules
and particularly to the points #f.

Think a bit on them....



jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Think a bit on them....

YES SIR!!

Physically disconnect the second hard disk.

i disconnected the second hard disk. no change in booting pattern.

I would try running Chkdisk, first thing and the hard disk manufacturer test/diagnosing utility second.

chkdisk didn't report anything wrong .
when i tried the hard disk manufacturer test/diagonising utility , first hard disk (which have windows 7) passed the test successfully.
second hard disk ( which don't have any OS) gives some error and an option was prompted for repairing it , so i chooses the repair option . After that i rechecked the hard disk and it passed the test this time.

Now i have detached the second hard disk permanently . but the problem is still persisting.

See if you have an option like "Reset Configuration data" in it, or however choose "Load failsafe settings" (or the equivalnt in your BIOS) nad se if anything changes.

i have an option for loading default settings in bios , i tried that .
problem same as before.

[was_jaclaz]

Still, the "wrong" BCD seems not like justifying the difference in access time between normal MBR+bootsector and direct grub4dos chainloading of BOOTMGR.

However:

How to make this "BRAND new BCD" .

With BCDEdit.

Read here:
http://ye110beard.spaces.live.com/Blog/cns...!1672.entry

and here:
http://www.msfn.org/...ds-t131560.html
http://www.computing...a-hd-/2448.html


Another question, what happens during the delay? Is the hard disk spinning and making some noise like it was trying to seek for/access a file not in the initial part of the disk or scattered in several places?

Where are BOOTMGR boot\BCD and WINLOAD.EXE located in the filesystem?
Diskview:
http://technet.micro...s/bb896650.aspx
Are they contiguous?
Contig:
http://technet.micro...s/bb897428.aspx
Wincontig:
http://wincontig.mdtzone.it/en/

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Try making a BRAND new BCD file

Rebuilded the BCD after deleting old BCD.
No changes in delay

Another question, what happens during the delay? Is the hard disk spinning and making some noise like it was trying to seek for/access a file not in the initial part of the disk or scattered in several places?

During delay , there is no hard disk activity( led indicator for hard disk activity don't blinks during delay)

Are they contiguous?

contig is reporting that the files bootmgr , BCD and winload.exe are in one fragment.

Where are BOOTMGR boot\BCD and WINLOAD.EXE located in the filesystem?

reports by diskview:
bootmgr ----------- disk cluters are 56342-563515
bcd ---------------somewhat same location as of bootmgr (i have to boot from vistape to see location of BCD.)
winload.exe ------a message was displayed "specified file do not occupy any cluster."

[was_jaclaz]

I am coming really short of ideas.
We checked (correct me if I am missing something):

• MBR
• PBR
• BCD
• Filesystem
• Hard Disk
• contiguity of files
• position of files

Though the winload.exe message is "strange"

Maybe it depends on the attributes of the file ot on your credentials (UAC+Run as Administrator)?

BUt if a problem is somehow connected to WINLOAD.EXE the delay should happen "between" BCD and Winload.exe, not "before" BCD.

Try adding an entry in BCD for grub4dos:
http://diddy.boot-la...ws.htm#windows3

Is the delay the same?

Try removing the normal Windows 7 entry and leave just the grub4dos entry.

Is the delay the same?

jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

Try removing the normal Windows 7 entry and leave just the grub4dos entry.

Is the delay the same?

yes delay is the same.

Try removing the normal Windows 7 entry and leave just the grub4dos entry.

Is the delay the same?

same delay.

@jaclaz
GOD!!! ,this problem is turning nasty and i am exhausted.

Better close this topic now. ( maybe i am missing some elements in this problem)

Anyway,
Thanks for taking so much pain to help me.
you were a great help and i learn t some new things during this discussion

ps:
will post the solution here , if i find someday.

[was_jaclaz]

Hmmm , you are giving up right in the middle of the challenge.

http://en.wikiquote....;s_Animal_House

And it ain't over now. 'Cause when the goin' gets tough...[pauses to remember the rest of the phrase]... the tough get goin'! Who's with me? Let's go!
....
.....

I would still try with the floppy image and see what happens....



jaclaz

[shamurshamur]

I would still try with the floppy image and see what happens....

i would love to try that but sadly my pc dont have floppy drive.

[was_jaclaz]

i would love to try that but sadly my pc dont have floppy drive.

That's why I was talking about a floppy image.

What I am failing to understand is if the problem is in the actual loading of BOOTMGR, in the actual loading of the BCD or in something else (processing info inside the BCD? ).



jaclaz