73 replies to this topic

[cdob]

As for build time:
The greatest winbuilder invention is the worst addon: integrated compressed files.
That's fine at some small integrated files (kb size), but a nightmare at big integrated files (mb size).

It's nonsese to decompress files at each run. Expand files once.

There are hard links at NTFS. Don't copy files, create a hard link instead.

[MedEvil]

But bartPE didn't added any SATA drivers, didn't added the explorer shell, didn't added tons of app scripts, didn't optimized the project files, etc, etc.

It used XPE and a few of my own addons. Mainly it was just to compare hardware support in BartPE with native XPE against Core NaugthyPE.
Feature wise and iso size wise BartPE had all the disadvantages in build time, yet was way faster. Even building NaughtyPE with the latest Beta could not beat BPE speed record.

Else i absolutely agree with Nuno. Better have the build taking a bit longer and impressing the user with functionality and eye candy, than being fast and giving the user the feeling that even that time, was a total waste.

I usually check software more thoroughly before throwing it away, but generally speaking, if i find 2 programs which are both equal feature wise, but non is really good or bad. The one giving a good out of the box impression, has the higher chance to stay on my HDD.

[Lancelot]

As for build time:
The greatest winbuilder invention is the worst addon: integrated compressed files.
That's fine at some small integrated files (kb size), but a nightmare at big integrated files (mb size).

It's nonsese to decompress files at each run. Expand files once.

There are hard links at NTFS. Don't copy files, create a hard link instead.

Most use NTFS, but not everybody

The idea at post 48 is solution for speed including your concern, but as nobody interested or helped and i am busy with another script, it will take long time to make a working example for this idea, but i will because i love it

[Brito]

Bring on the eye-candy and sound support and we'll get happy users of a cool boot disk!

Please allow me to tell you a secret:
There really exist people with a different opinion.

If I e.g. come into a site demanding flash player installed (I do not have it), I say "Bye, site"

Peter

Yes, but removing desktop, visual themes, mass storage drivers, tweaks and such things assumed as time wasters would truly get us a barebone nativeEx project.

LiveXP always had in mind a plethora of balance on visual look and features that users enjoy.

NativeEx has in mind a stable minimal build with the less fluff as possible that users also enjoy.

Each project has it's target audience well defined, so why mixing things up and make both the same?

I'm of the opinion that LiveXP should look even better, risk more in terms of visual appeal while adding more freeware programs/features of interest to users, like the flash player in case it's desired to browse the internet while the computer is broken.

----

As for build time:
The greatest winbuilder invention is the worst addon: integrated compressed files.
That's fine at some small integrated files (kb size), but a nightmare at big integrated files (mb size).

It's nonsese to decompress files at each run. Expand files once.

And I thinking to myself that the best inventions might have been the download center, the interface section of scripts, the scriptable language, the app scripts, etc..

The question of big sized attachments is a product of the script coding, not something to which winbuilder.exe should be held responsible.

------------

For example, the unpack function that is defined inside api.script and used by most app scripts to extract files from inside the script onto the target folder could be modified to unpack the file onto the project's temporary folder first and then copy it over to the destination target.

Would take some extra parsecs on the first build but would with no doubt be faster on the second run as it would skip the extraction process in case the file would already be available at the project temp folder.

This is something that can indeed be improved so I suggest starting a new topic at the development section of winbuilder so that other developers can help exploring it, perhaps even Pedrole15 has some time to work this over.

[pscEx]

Yes, but removing desktop, visual themes, mass storage drivers, tweaks and such things assumed as time wasters would truly get us a barebone nativeEx project.

And that is the best we can have

Peter

BTW:
There may be a minority of several million people compared with the mayority of me, having a different opinion ...
The only one I'm missing in my mayority is Jaclaz ...
But maybe he does not like to agree me ...

[pscEx]

Today I made a new test:

Host XP SP3 German

Deleted the complete existing LiveXP directory
Downloaded a 'recommended' LiveXP
Defined source CD to XP SP3 German
Built the project.

qEmu came up
PENetwork started, found the Realtec (qEmu) network driver and did some installation

I started opera > no internet connection.
Also ping brought no connection.

Peter

[Galapo]

Is it working in nativeEx?

VMware is working for me. Will test qEmu in the morning...

Thanks,
Galapo.

[pscEx]

Is it working in nativeEx?

Yes.

BTW: Both WB Beta 5 T

Peter

[Galapo]

Got to test a bit earlier. Working for me with xpsp2 English.

So I don't know.

Regards,
Galapo.

[pscEx]

Got to test a bit earlier. Working for me with xpsp2 English.

XP SP2 English also has no intenet connection in qEmu.

Did you test exactly as I described?

Peter

[Galapo]

I used LiveXP recommended, booted to qEmu, and used Opera. I was able to browse Google.

Will look at this more tomorrow.

Regards,
Galapo.

[pscEx]

I used LiveXP recommended, booted to qEmu, and used Opera. I was able to browse Google.

I tried again in a different (empty) directory, and now it was ok.

No idea what happened

Peter

[Brito]

Also tried the "Recommended" download for testing wb 075 beta 6 from Peter, the download was a bit heavy on my slow dialup but the project worked nevertheless very well with the new beta.

[pscEx]

Also tried the "Recommended" download for testing wb 075 beta 6 from Peter, the download was a bit heavy on my slow dialup but the project worked nevertheless very well with the new beta.

OK

• publish the new beta, it looks rather good
• simultaniously I'm presenting a new bug found by ctmag
  (fortunatelly appearing so rarelly that it does not affect 99,9% of the users and NONE of existing scripts)
  "Some really DEADLY troubles with comment lines"

I already fixed, and so, just some minutes after a 99,9% stable beta 6 some explorers will have the possibility to work with beta 7 a

Seriously to Nuno: No reason to wait with beta 6. This is just a 'needle inside the beach of complete Florida'. But we found the needle and will remove it.

Peter

[Jumanji]

Dear Ladies and Gandlemans,

I need download the ETBoot.part1.rar , but some come everytime a ERROR . What can i Do. Or can you said me the anotter download Site.
I Want make a WINDOWS XP DVD who can startet of all Computers.

Thank You for Help
JUMANJI

[pscEx]

Dear Ladies and Gandlemans,

I need download the ETBoot.part1.rar , but some come everytime a ERROR . What can i Do. Or can you said me the anotter download Site.
I Want make a WINDOWS XP DVD who can startet of all Computers.

Thank You for Help
JUMANJI

Hi Jumanji,
First a 'Welcome in our community'

In the LiveXP forum you are a bit displaced with your question.

You should post this question in the ETBoot topic.

Nevertheless: I could download w/o any troubles. So the reason propably is due to something at your site.

[German] Offensichtlich hast Du mit Englisch Schwierigkeiten. Es gibt da ein Forum "Boot Land > Groups > Community forum > International support > German", wo die Fragen auf Deutsch besprochen werden können. Aber besser ist es natürlich, sich im Hauptforum durchzukämpfen. Hier schauen einfach mehr Leute rein.[/German]

Peter

[pscEx]

To test the new WinBuilder 077 beta 2 before publishing, I made a test with LiveXP.

• Download latest stuff (complete)
• Defined source CD
• Built
• Run in VirtualBox
  (after some rebuilds due to network drivers which are not relevant here)
• Tried some programs

The first program "a-squared free" suggested an update, and I agreed. Than it hang.

I tried "CDImageGUI", played around a bit (of course I did not try to burn anything). Then I exited:
Error message that the app was not able to write to drive X:


Suggestion:

The 'factory settings' should define

• EITHER Something making the ISO writable, BootSDI, FBWF or whatelse
• OR Deselect all scripts wanting to write to the system drive
• OR Change the scripts to write to the RAM drive

Peter

[Lancelot]

PEter psc

fixes/investigations are on the way

verrry mostly this method used on livexp project scripts

• OR Deselect all scripts wanting to write to the system drive

i dont know how CDImageGUI selected with such a bugy . (it is there since my first days of livexp)
i will retest a-squared free too (it didnt hang in my previous tests, but will check)

thanks for reporting, we always need the feedback like in any project

[Lancelot]

Peter psc:

CDImageGUI:
application likes to write an .ini file during close. But it does not effect it is working (which i assume was the reason selected true by galapo). To prevent future annoyance, i change state to selected false

a-squared
in my tests didnt hang, only couldnt update.
A regular PE user should be smart enough to copy it to a writeable media inorder to update
well, AV applications are recommended by livexp, so i keep it as it is,
and also add info to Apps\Security\AntiVirus\folder.project

both uploads done on livexp server.

ps: future plans to remove a-squared to get recommended size smaller, but there will always be other Av scripts in LiveXP.

[pscEx]

A regular PE user should be smart enough to copy it to a writeable media inorder to update
well, AV applications are recommended by livexp, so i keep it as it is,
and also add info to Apps\Security\AntiVirus\folder.project

Here you hit what I want to tell the world with this topic!

I'm not a regular PE user!
I downloaded WinBuilder with LiveXP for the first time, build, and run the PE.
The app asks me to update.

I'm a dummy user. I do not copy anything to anywhere. I just say 'Yes, update'

And that gives me unexpected results:

For me: WinBuilder is Bulls..., Forget it, Try BartPE

Exactly: The Bulls... is WinBuilder, not the project, not the script, not the app!

Peter

Especially @my friend Lancelot:
When I do not answer in this topic any more, it is not a confrontation. It is because I do not have to add any more, and because I'm now focussed on the next beta.

Try to make yourself a dummy user and as dummy user test the current 'factory settings'

Peter

[Lancelot]

Peter

if a-squared cause livexp collapse or unexpected results, than i would love to disable it.
But simply, it tries to download, and says "i can not connect to download".
If one tries to use with bartpe, he will get the same result


As you know, except the first few things on this topic, I try to find a mid solution to all your demands (in any topic) for livexp.
You should accept that ALL your critics on LiveXP are taken considiration (some rejected, some fixed, some midway, some corrected your accusation..etc.etc..).
Either Resulting with agree or disagree, I always listen to you, and try to do my best.
I have future plans for livexp to be more "dummy user" friendly (but not for "absolutely dummy user" friendly )
But you know, i have turtle speed and todo list never ends


In future for factory settings, i guess we will have, simpler script.project gui, smaller recommended size with faster builds, give more time..

Good luck with next beta

[pscEx]

But simply, it tries to download, and says "i can not connect to download".
If one tries to use with bartpe, he will get the same result

In spite what I said last post, here the VERY LAST reply:

#1: It CAN download, but it cannot WRITE!

#2: If you look into my profile: I like to do what others cannot do! If BartPE has a 'bad' result, there are a lot of ways to do it better here.
WinBuilder offers the possibility.

But you have to be creative and leave the 'common' ways!

Peter

[Lancelot]

#1: It CAN download, but it cannot WRITE!

Really not my fault, , blame emsisoft.com tech guys

#2: If you look into my profile: I like to do what others cannot do! If BartPE has a 'bad' result, there are a lot of ways to do it better here.
WinBuilder offers the possibility.

But you have to be creative and leave the 'common' ways!

yep, and i am aware what from the beginin your are asking for. But time my friend and a long todo list . With todo list in my mind and having the speed of a turtle it is really annoying to spend a lot of time to make a very dummy user to use a-square. But yes you are right about looking from the "First touch" perpective.
besides this "writeable media" situation (or with other words: absance of a loader situation),
a-squre 3 free occupy lots of space for recommended livexp
There is a-squre 4 on the emsisoft website (waiting for a script author to write a dummy proof script )

So i remove a-squre 3 free from livexp project. Such a simple script with a lot of space causing a big trouble
and move it on livexp extra here + adding a textbox for warning, where a "non dummy" user required there . (A user should visit there after "The First, Second Third ... touch" )


@Galapo
Welcome back galapo, i hope you approve my decision .

[Galapo]

Welcome back galapo, i hope you approve my decision .

Yes, I agree. The script has been there the last while mainly because it has always been there. Now it's not and that's fine too.

Regards,
Galapo.